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prntrkmt
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rev. Adam wrote:
F.U.C.K. is also an acronym for "Fornication Under Consent of the King", and is the earliest origins of the word that I know of.

In the old days you needed the King's consent to be messing around. Neighbors or friends would come over, see the sign, and say "FUCK, they're not answering!" Laughing


It is commonly claimed (even in some very reputable reference books!) that the word "fuck" is an acronym for "For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge" and "Fornication Under the Control/Consent/Command of the King' (or "Christian King").

But the word "fuck" appears in large number of English documents from long BEFORE the words "fornication" and "carnal" existed in the English language.

The oldest form of the word in Old English is "fucken". The word comes from Old German. Similar words in the family group include Germanic ficken, Dutch fokken, Norwegian fukka, and Swedish focka.

Fuck (in the form "fucken") is among oldest known words in the English language.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey, don't ruin it for me! Laughing
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prntrkmt
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 5:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spin~ello wrote:
I am pretty sure it is against the law to claim to be a "charity" & not have non profit status.
Please show me proof of non profit status.
Posing as a charity is from my comprehension a crime & a common con.


I know I'm going to regret having read your posting, much less responding, but here is the U.S. law:

Under federal law, churches and literary socieities are automatically considered to be charities under the law. Churches are considered to automatically be charities under section 508 and this is based on an IRS belief that the first amendment requires the government to recognize churches as legitimate without requiring any proof. Churches aren't even required to file any tax paperwork. I have no idea why literary societies also get the same treatment.

All other charities are required to get an official 501(c)(3) Determination Letter from the IRS. The IRS annually publishes a list of all charities that have received a Determination Letter. Those letters are very difficult to get. it can take months of paperwork, as the IRS keeps asking for more and more documentation of all kinds of stuff. And the fee is variable (starting at $500 for the smallest charities and possibly going into tens of thousands of dollars -- and that's just the IRS fees, not the cost of your lawyers who are filling out all that paperwork).

There is a $5,000 exception. If a charity never has more than $5,000 in income for ANY year, then it is exempt at the federal level.

Not all churches are 501(c)(3) charities. It is the choice of the church whether it wants to be 501 or 508. There are obscure legal differences between the two, and I honestly don't understand them all (I'm not a lawyer). It seems that the vast majority of big churches are 501 (although Catholic Charities USA with almost $3billion a year in donated income is NOT a 501). A whole bunch of small churches, especially right wing Christian churches are 508 and stubbornly refuse to be 501.

Some states also have a Corporation Sole. I mention this only for completeness. Corporation Sole was originally intended to give legal standing to the offices of bishops, archbishops, cardinals, and other high ranking church officials. The "sole" refers to the single office holder. The Corporation Sole is the legal entity for the church office. Whoever is appointed by the church into that position is legally represented by the Corporation Sole. This provides legal continuity for those high ranking church offices. I might mention that for the last several years the IRS has been checking into all new Corporations Sole to make sure they are actual church officers because a bunch of people have been using it as a tax scam. If you start a new Corporation Sole, you can be certain that an IRS agent will be visiting soon. Once the IRS agent is satisfied that it is real, the Corporation Sole is automatically a charity and doesn't have to file any more paperwork with the feds.

My guess (without knowing for certain) is that Roger's church is a 508 church.

Very few churches actually obtain a Determination Letter, simply because it is so expensive a process and they aren't required by law to have it. Some large churches and most of the large denominations of Christianity have obtained the Determination Letter just so they can be added to the IRS's official list. This is so they can get large grants. Foundations making large grants typically insist on seeing a Determination Letter, even for churches.

Remember, I'm NOT a lawyer, so if you need real details about your church's legal status, you should pay for some time with a real lawyer who works in the field of non-profits -- or an accountant who is an Enrolled Agent. Sometimes the lawyer will work pro-bono (for free).
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reverendquenzer
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spinello I was not aiming that paragraph at you. I was not damning you or your words. I believe that you read into peoples words too deeply. Learn to take things at face value rather than reinterperate them in a different context. This I believe is where the christian church originated by falsely interpereting someone elses words of wisdom into a context that was not intended through the original phrasing. No wonder they are soo off track. Spinn just stop redefining everything. People usually will say things the exact way they mean it. Not with some hidden message. Yes some people speak one thing and mean another but don't aply that asumption to everyone.
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prntrkmt
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Location: southern California

PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rev. Adam wrote:
Hey, don't ruin it for me! Laughing


Didn't mean to ruin your fun. I actually think it is pretty cool that fuck may be the oldest word in the English language. Of all the three quarters of a million words in the English language, it is kind of cool that a word the Chrstian right hates so much is a leading candidate for the oldest word in the language.

And the antiquity of the word shows up in its extreme versatility. Very few words in the English language have more different meanings and no other word has a wide a range of different meanings.
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Spin~ello
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aloha every1

prntrkmt wrote:
Quote:
Do you have a new logo for FUCK?


Ferre
Here is a quick rough draft of some lettering(not a logo),I created.
You are free to use it (it fits header1.gif though it is a png *the one above the forum*)

I am free & open to suggestions to improve or add stuff(if you like it) or try to create a logo.
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prntrkmt
Please answer my Qs from post Sun Jun 03, 2007 3:41 pm in this thread:
http://www.thc-ministry.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8462&start=15

About the 501 status of prntrkmt.org & my other Qs such as my exposing your involvement that you tried to deny/lessen ,in that thread:
Quote:
Pr Ntr Kmt is a spiritual religion (501(c)(3) non-profit Church, as defined by U.S. law)


I am not a IRS code expert or lawyer.
but when I wrote:
Quote:
I am pretty sure it is against the law to claim to be a "charity" & not have non profit status.
Please show me proof of non profit status.
Posing as a charity is from my comprehension a crime & a common con.

I do know certain legally required disclaimers/disclosures are lacking from Rogers & your(prntrkmt.org) churches.
I am not going to tell you or roger how to legally run you operations by placing what is required by law in this post ,because IMO it would be aiding people I see as con~men.

I do know the post you made is full of misinformation in the form of over simplification of IRS law which is tricky & volumes deep IMO.

Quote:
I know I'm going to regret having read your posting, much less responding, but here is the U.S. law:

That is not "the U.S. law" that is a couple of paragraphs.
The law is many tricky pages long(if not volumes) & takes a lawyer type to *fully* decipher ,of which neither you nor I are.

It seems like you are asking me to call the IRS to verify the misinformation that you IMO spew ,they do not charge citizens anything if they suspect a charity(or any tax issue) smells non legit.IMO Roger is not as unwise or blatant in his IMO scam as you ,such as the way you place (501(c)(3) in prntrkmt.org literature.(I do know both of you would be in deep shit if I picked up the phone & called the IRS)[Which I do not want to do ,but if I am pushed by either of you to do so just might.
Example:Placing posts like the one you just made here to try to simplify & justify IMO clear violations from what I comprehend.Thus I might need an IRS agent to verify said claims such as the ones in the post you just made if such claims do not cease.)

So please prntrkmt answer the post I keep asking you to answer.
Since you have broke you word :
Quote:
After a couple attempts to reply, it became obvious that you simply want to abuse me and I have no interest in playing your game.

I understand that you have some kind of pathological hatred towards me and that you want to annoy me. Write a million messages. I will not respond again.

You response = your word has little mana from what I see ,now that you
responded to something I have posted.

P.S.
Here is some more made up prntrkmt B.S. :
Quote:
But the word "fuck" appears in large number of English documents from long BEFORE the words "fornication" and "carnal" existed in the English language.

Fuck from the etymology dictionary @:
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=fuck&searchmode=none
Fuck
Written form only attested from early 16c. OED 2nd edition cites 1503, in the form fukkit; earliest appearance of current spelling is 1535

fornication from the etymology dicionary @:
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=fornication&searchmode=none
fornication c.1300,(I am pretty sure this means the earliest written evidence is found is from that date)

carnal from the etymology dictionary @:
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=carnal&searchmode=none
carnal c.1400,(I am pretty sure this means the earliest written evidence is found is from that date)

Thus 1505 for its(fucks) current form is not earlier than the dates for fornication c.1300 nor carnal c.1400.Once again demonstrating the BS claims prntrkmt fills the internet with as he presents things as facts or solid knowledge.Show me other wise prntrkmt ,maybe you have other "sources".

I am so saddened that people might take anything prntrkmt states as having validity with all the made up stuff he writes as if it is fact.I recently saw a post where members asked for his sources & he claimed TV & an unnamed or given Los Angeles Times article.
http://www.thc-ministry.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=456&start=30
Quote:
The information is gathered from multiple sources, mostly documentaries on Science Channel, Discovery Channel, History Channel, and History International, as well as articles that appeared in the Los Angeles Times.

rotflmao


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reverendquenzer
Quote:
Learn to take things at face value rather than reinterperate them in a different context.

Are you telling me to learn?How about adding "you might want to learn" or something like that.Words to me expose often hidden stuff.
Fact every word that is spoken is interpreted & defined in the mind of the writer & reader separately.Words have many definitions.You IMO are ignorant of language & how dialog works or how individuals see in their own free way to accuse me of reinterpreting & placing them in a different context(I do not know your context).I am not you & would not know your interpretation or context.

I do know you wrote:"Spinello Damn thats a lot to read... eyes hurt."
***this wording places the context of Damn @ me or my post.***
You did not phrase it:Spinello thats a lot to read...Damn my eyes hurt.
***this would have placed Damn on your eyes***
How convenient the context you choose & since you say I took it out of context you prove I do not know your context.I do know what your war & "So BRING IT ON " mindset is really thinking on levels so deep you are apparently completely unaware of.

Whether you are aware of it or not ,you did cast a spell @ me & I diffused it of any mana toward me.It does show your subliminal mind in action to which IMO you are unaware of the power of words & clueless to the mana they possess.(this is not an insult as most are unaware & clueless to what I speak of)
Quote:
This I believe is where the christian church originated by falsely interpereting someone elses words of wisdom into a context that was not intended through the original phrasing.

Blame human language not me.Every person sees a picture or word differently.
Quote:
Spinn just stop redefining everything.

My name is not spinn.
You show me you are stooping to making fun of my name.A common thing done in forums & in life when one has lacks substance in a situation or conflict of minds.(in IMO & experience.)
(does "jpint of cannabis"/Spinello/spin~ello threaten or scare you with his post(s).Does he challenge your mind or let you see things you were unaware of & it scares or threatens you ,as I expose others to my mind as I expose things I am aware of.)

Quote:
People usually will say things the exact way they mean it. Not with some hidden message.

I know & have un'ear'thed the crypt within script.If you knew what is going on in the background deep within words(& letters) you would cry like a baby or run in fear IMO.The "the word" as Xtians like to call it/them is so deep ,you are IMO clueless to it/their mana & control over the masses with hidden secrets.It is so powerful to control/domesticate/guide the masses "the word" is god according to Xtians.In other words their are hidden messages & power within all words & even the letters(Alpha to Omega[or Z]) you are unaware of.Thus as people write or speak I am aware of things hidden that you seem clueless to.

Quote:
To all of those who chose to attack roger (not you malory) Roger has his faults but that is no reason to attack a man who has acomplished so much in his own direction. If you dissagree with his intentions follow your own path. Don't start war with someone who is fighting your enemy (DEA). He has done great work weather you like his motive or not.

Who is it directed @.
Just David.You state it is not directed @ malloryjade.

It sounded like you intended it to include me(even though you deny so) so since I know I have exposed Roger & can tell from the things you write you seem to wish to be his defender & you seem to label people without giving names attackers.
here is my reply:
Quote:
Roger has his faults but that is no reason to attack a man who has acomplished so much in his own direction. If you dissagree with his intentions follow your own path.

I do think everyone has their own path.
IMO this forum is not abut following Roger.
It seems you think a war has started.IMO it looks like even Ferre has had enough & disagrees with Rogers path.I find you use words of war & end your writing to David with "So BRING IT ON " this tells me you are a violent minded person whom seems seeks violence & provoke attacks.

Quote:
Don't start war with someone who is fighting your enemy (DEA).

I am not starting a war.(your mind seems to label my exposing Roger with facts & opinions as warlike.You must be threatened to use a word that is so full of horror.The DEA is not my enemy & I am not @ war with them.I do disagree with them & they are @ war as you & them call it with cannabis sales ,use ,& growing ,not me.I have not ever battled them or intend to.

IMO you seem to be saying do not expose the dealing & funding issues of Roger as I see them with facts insights & opinions ,because in your mind he is some one whom has done great work as you call it.I call it different & if "I had the goods" so to say on any charity even if they did do things like feed or clothe children in Africa 4 instance ,I would speak up.IMO you seem to be saying since he has done great(in your eyes) work ,no one should speak against him.I notice you do not defend his dealing or speak up that it is not productive to being seen in a positive light by outsiders of cannabis religious movements that need to legitimize themselves in the eyes of the masses to gain respect.(example the feds & everyday people that fear cannabis as a drug).I suppose you do not care if CraigX sets the movement back using THC ministry in his defence (if he loses his case & or possibly sets precedent against THC ministry & all cannabis religions) or that Rogers is dealing what IMO gave CraigX the Idea to deal sacrament/cannabis 4 money/profit.I do not throw the baby out with the bathwater ,so to say.I clean the shit out of the babies pants when I see it or smell it.It appears you love the baby but seem not to care to get your hands dirty by touching the shit/BS.

I bid(offer)U all peace
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Pay heed,I plead,Plant the seed ,. 4 we all
need, the reed weed seed
to be freed, from greed and creeds!

I bid(offer)U peace
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Grannymouse
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was under the impression that ALL churches and religions are constitutionally considered FREE of govt, here in the usa, at least. It is only when they sign into 'anything' with the govt, that they come under the govt's 'control'. You are not 'legally required' to do anything with your church! That would be interFEARence by the govt!

Right Earth Monastery has no intention of signing on as "Not-for-profit" or "Non-profit". It would/could give the govt permission/control over what could be done. (I'm thinking about stuff like 'ambassadors for peace' etc.)

Soooo sorry. If any entity wishes to throw money at Right Earth Monastery, they will not be able to 'deduct' a cent. (Right Earth Monastery does not accept monetary donations, at this time.) So really, how much money does a 'donor' 'lose' by donating to a free church? So, if i planned to give away a hemp fiber chain for every 1000 dollars that would be donated by some person, i could just 'make it up to them' by only asking for 750 dollars for a donation to get a free hemp fiber chain???? Or give them two hemp fiber chains for that 1000 dollar donation???? I dunno, i think that if that tax deduction is so much more important than the donation, why do i want that person to donate anyway?

There are other ways to be 'recognized' by the govt, than by signing into THEIR adgenda, which may be great during one administration and 'insane' during another admin. A religion/church usually does not wish to be subject to the whims of human govt, but has allegiance to a higher entity, be that a god/dess or a 'higher self'.

I realize that some churches may wish to take out a govt-backed loan for that steeple or addition, but at what cost? I'd rather stay a home-based faith than trade my freedom for a steeple.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Grannymouse. The IRS is not a LEGAL entity as it is anyway.

IRS tax code is NOT a law. It is a code that attempts to make itself law through some VERY shifty measures. It is the most bastardized institution within our government.

For churches, it is pretty much the same as it is for the individual. You do NOT become a tax payer until you file your first 1040. At that point, you are a taxpayer, and are subject to the IRS tax code. However, if you NEVER file, you are NEVER subject to pay taxes. Most people having tax evasion problems stopped filing after filing before. You "opt in" as a taxpayer and make YOURSELF part of the tax system when you file.

Same with a church. It is a charitable organization protected by the constitution. The govt actually has NO business worrying about what a church does or how much money it receives. Until a church "opts in" by becoming a 501 charity, the IRS and feds have no legal reason to harass any religious groups.

I find it sad that you would even mention calling the IRS and the feds. As far as I am concerned any person, entity, or organization that attempts to wield even the slightest amount of control over another being to be absolutely EVIL to the core. Why you even begin to mention contacting those on the dark side of higher conscious is beyond me.
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Police officers acquitted for beating a 64 yr old man recently in New Orleans. In the words of their defense attorney "all he had to do was comply"....and they wouldn't have fractured his face.
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Spin~ello
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aloha Grannymouse
Quote:
I was under the impression that ALL churches and religions are constitutionally considered FREE of govt, here in the usa, at least.It is only when they sign into 'anything' with the govt, that they come under the govt's 'control'.

It is not that simple.
Simply look @ laws against multiple wives 4 example.
Or human sacrifice in Aztec rituals.
Bibles have stone people to death 4 certain deeds passages as laws/rules/codes 4 followers to obey.
That is just to name a few situations where legal interFEARence by the govt! does have "control"."Soooo sorry" & sad 4 cannabis partakers like you & me in the case of cannabis(@the moment).But I am 4 1 glad human sacrifice & stoning to death is not allowed by law & that no "rights" or "freedom of religion" protections shall ever allow stoning or killing as a ritual or as a religious dogma/teaching/code/instruction.


Quote:
Right Earth Monastery has no intention of signing on as "Not-for-profit" or "Non-profit". It would/could give the govt permission/control over what could be done. (I'm thinking about stuff like 'ambassadors for peace' etc.)

I do not see Right Earth Monastery (or you if it is your church) asking for money to fund your personal life & calling it donations or a charity.I do not see you placing (501(c)(3) non-profit Church material on sites or books about your church as prntrkmt does.


Quote:
There are other ways to be 'recognized' by the govt, than by signing into THEIR adgenda, which may be great during one administration and 'insane' during another admin.

Being recognized by the govt is different than the reality that donations & charities do have laws & rules involved.

Quote:
A religion/church usually does not wish to be subject to the whims of human govt, but has allegiance to a higher entity, be that a god/dess or a 'higher self'.

They may not wish to be subject to the whims of human govt but are in many areas.

Quote:
I realize that some churches may wish to take out a govt-backed loan for that steeple or addition, but at what cost? I'd rather stay a home-based faith than trade my freedom for a steeple.

I live my religion/spirituality & my church is anywhere I go ,my steeple is my mind.Thus I need no loans. Smile

Rev. Adam
Quote:
IRS tax code is NOT a law.

It seems to be used to place people in prison.(I do not agree with it but I am not going to act like if I do not agree with it ,it does not exist.)
I do agree it is shifty.

Quote:
However, if you NEVER file, you are NEVER subject to pay taxes.

Are you that naive.(I do not intent to be rude but is that what you really think)

Quote:
Same with a church. It is a charitable organization protected by the constitution. The govt actually has NO business worrying about what a church does or how much money it receives. Until a church "opts in" by becoming a 501 charity, the IRS and feds have no legal reason to harass any religious groups.

So if a church does not file & a citizen notifies the IRS that a church calling itself a charity or taking donations in a strange manner that seems not to be actual donations but sales ,you think their are no legal ramifications requirements or rules because they have not filed.

Quote:
I find it sad that you would even mention calling the IRS and the feds.

I have mentioned the IRS ,asking in a manner of "is that they want me to do" & every time I have said I do not want to in the same sentence.I did not call nor do I intend to but I could be pushed into it if statements of law are used to make things sound fully legit on matters I know in a few areas are not.Neither he nor I are fully knowledgeable on the subject admittedly ,yet he posted a justification & called it "the US law" on the subject.It is not that simple & I said if he pushes that which is over my head ,I could or might need to go to the IRS to confirm such claims ,because I am not going to pay a lawyer(I have no need to confirm such things).I have no intension's of calling & was making for the most part a sarcastic eye opening statement to make them more aware that someone might or could & bring heat on their IMO scams.
I prefer to expose them to the things I find & my opinions here.I have said this before ,so I said it again.

Quote:
As far as I am concerned any person, entity, or organization that attempts to wield even the slightest amount of control over another being to be absolutely EVIL to the core.

Parents do it daily.I do not find that is usually evil ,as you call it.
Entities like govs do it so rampant murder & killings do not happen without consequence just to name one reason.I do not find it is evil in that situation.Many people are in prisons 4 extreme crimes against others.

I am not controlling any person here.
Are you calling me evil.
What comes next are you going to Damn me as well.
I mentioned contacting "those on the dark side of higher conscious" as you call them ,4 the reason that it is a wake up call IMO that I state it 2 them & have no intension's of doing it to make them aware that others could & might due to what is being presented.It seems you agree with the selling of cannabis oil.& the calling of sales transactions & kits misleadingly IMO donations.I suppose you think that placing "Pr Ntr Kmt is a spiritual religion (501(c)(3) non-profit Church)" out for people to read & it not actuality being one is OK as well.I suppose you agree with & condone the IMO con games being played on people.I do not.I suppose you agree with & condone the things I just mentioned as you have called me evil from my perspective & said nothing to label the things I point out as evil(as you call things).I "have no"t called the IRS,yet they are "actually are" IMO duping people.Roger enough that it seems even Ferre does not seem to approve of or wish to be associated with his ways anymore.Calling people evil & labeling groups as the dark side IMO = as prntrkmt likes to say IMO = a witch hunt mentality.Trying to call me evil & phrases like the dark side tell me so.I would think that saying you disagree would do ,yet you resort to bible based words such as evil & attempt to IMO label me as such.I do not think of you Roger or prntrkmt or anyone as evil.I simply try not resort to such words to try to rally support to a side (dark ones or light ones).I rely on my info & insights in my posts.I had a neighbor that worked for the IRS when I was young.He was a very nice person IMO ,whom seemed to love his family & those I saw him interact with.I do not like the IRS but would not ever label him "as those on the dark side".I do not pick sides I expose & dis"sect" angles.


I bid(offer)U all peace ,even those that call me evil (from my perspective) or damn me (from my perspective).I agree to disagree.But shall not be silenced of expressing my perspective ,by people attempting to damn or label me as evil.I do not need to & try not resort to such weak tactics.
_________________
My surname Spinello
means "jOINT of cannabis" in Italian.
JOINT as in anOINT ,appOINT & OINTment.

Check out my Hemperor & Hawaii themes for Firefox.

Pay heed,I plead,Plant the seed ,. 4 we all
need, the reed weed seed
to be freed, from greed and creeds!

I bid(offer)U peace
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reverendquenzer
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPINN <if you are offended by that it is your own problem. Your rants are off the wall. You may see "hidden meaning" in everything but it isn't there. I'm not going to become another one spunn up in your spinnelo game. This will be my last reply to you for your words have no "mana" or value to my ears. If you think I damned anything your problem. As far as my challenge to David... he attacks me and I remain unscaved read the past conversations and you would see that. He can "bring it" if that is what he needs to do to blow off his self hate and blame others. His words nor his intentions will never hurt me. Your words hold no water cause they are a revolving door anything we say you spinnello to try and make you sound like a victim or like an educator. For someone who spent soo much time in nature you seem to have a good understanding of computers building banners researching tax laws and attacking those who put their lifes work on this page. leave us be.
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Spin~ello
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aloha every1

reverendquenzer
You seem to need to misspell my name(My screen name is spin~ello & my surname is Spinello not SPINN or spinnelo).Does it serve a need to do so ,or simply show me & possibly others here that you apparently need to resort to IMO childish bully like tactics.I know from my experience that when people resort to such a level of ignorance & disrespect ,it shows me they have no weight on a subject or topic & are simply grasping for mana. IMO this is very much like a bully on the playground of a school whom is threatened by mentally by one with glasses & thus calls him/her 4 eyes.

Quote:
If you think I damned anything your problem.

I have no problem of my own.I simply solve & dissect problems that I am shown ,& do not resort to such childish behavior as I am a grown man.I do frown on things & expose people to my views with what is within my crown ,when I see IMO seeds of ignorance being sown.

I do see hidden meanings & know hidden knowledge that you seem choose to remain clueless to as I slowly expose & show all that see'k or are able to see.Witches called spells "spells" 4 a reason.Words show me & others things you claim ignorantly are not there.The hidden stuff is not there to you.I am not the one playing games or cons.I am not the one calling people haters & ending posts with "So BRING IT ON ".I agree my words do not have mana or value to your ears ,as my words are not spoken & your ears are not processing my written words ,your brain & eyes are.I do know you attempted to cast a spell of damn @ me(I am aware you use the tool called words blindly on deep levels & are clueless to the complete mana of them.).I have no problem with your spell of Damn ,as I have blocked any mana it had with my awareness & dissection of your spell.

As for David you claim he attacks you(did it hurt) & you remain "unscaved" [unscathed].I do not need to read past conversations to see that David attacked you(as you call it).Your very words show me much of your IMO violent nature/mindset & I have seen you egg him on & provoke & thus yoke him to reply in this thread.If I did look back into you & Davids posts it would not be to see who was scathed ,it would be to find the root.You seem to enjoy giving David the label hater & have now it seems escalated to the point of labeling him a self hater & seem to be ignorant to the fact that calling him a hater & a self hater is going to cause make him release the steam caused by the fire caused by labeling him a hater.You seem clueless that you provoke & inflame David.You state his word wont hurt you ,but you seem to act wounded on a mental level.From what I see it seems he has hurt your feelings.

My words hold no water ,because my words flow & do not "vat or can" the water or intend to stop water from its flowing nature.I have not tried to or acted like a victim & I do intend to educate.There is a wise saying "one is either learning or teaching".I do both & relax @ times as well.I am a revolving door to evolving love:


Quote:
For someone who spent soo much time in nature you seem to have a good understanding of computers building banners researching tax laws and attacking those who put their lifes work on this page.

You seem to be implying that time in nature somehow would weaken my mana (lol) in areas such as computers ,building banners ,researching tax laws and attacking(as you call it.I call it expose) those who IMO scam & con people.
I have more experience ,knowledge & comprehension ,not understanding & I am only more cunning like a fox & clever like a monkey from my time in nature.

Quote:
leave us be.

Does "us" = your "me myself & I" or have others elected you to be their mouth piece.

I bid(offer)U all peace
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have my own voice.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spin....I agree with many others here. Your posts are bordering on schizo.... You are spinning way too many things up in your own head.

SHOW me the law that says the IRS and it's actions are legal.

Prove that I am wrong about filing a 1040.

Show me the law that says the IRS has any legal authority over religion and churches.

Don't just spin.

Show the law. Give me the reference. The head of the IRS has failed to do this publicly many times. I would love to see how you are going to pull it off.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aloha Rev. Adam

Quote:
Spin....I agree with many others here. Your posts are bordering on schizo.... You are spinning way too many things up in your own head.

Now I am schitzo.lol
I would rather be schitzo""split mind"" than one sided in my mind.
I prefer to be called spherical minded.
I have expressed my opinion that Roger & prntrkmt are con~artists & pointed out details.I did not nor do I condemn/damn Roger or prntrkmt nor do I think they are evil or on any dark side.

You state you "agree with many others here".I am not being rude or trying to make a joke ,but I have read no one else here label me to be bordering on schizo.Thus when I analyze your statement "you agree with many others here" that I am bordering on schitzo, I ask who is apparently showing signs of schizophrenia.Even reverendquenzer ends his post with "leave us be." as if he is more than one person.(IMO you & reverendquenzer seem to need to be backed up with seemingly imaginary speculative #s on your sides & are not content with the weight of your own minds.)

I am free to spin anything I wish in my head & have done no thing that is forbidden that I know of in this forum.I would rather spin stuff around to see everything from all directions rather than just take everything on simple face or surface value.

Quote:
SHOW me the law that says the IRS and it's actions are legal.

Prove that I am wrong about filing a 1040.

Show me the law that says the IRS has any legal authority over religion and churches.

Don't just spin.

Show the law. Give me the reference. The head of the IRS has failed to do this publicly many times. I would love to see how you are going to pull it off.

I do not need to show prove or give anything to you.
I am not here to pull things off 4 you.I am not your puppet.
If you want info go to IRS.com click "charities & non profits" click that link then it takes you a page that gives a link "Churches and Religious Orgs".

I have already stated that the law & taxes are very sketchy subjects.The IRS ,taxes ,codes ,& laws are sketchy in that they are open to interpretations by you & by judges with control over their cattle.
I am not a layer or an IRS agent.I say to you now like I did to prntrkmt are you asking me to call them?I do not intend to or wish to.So why are you pushing me for info that I would have no where else to go to seek your answers.

I do know that claiming (501(c)(3) non-profit & not being one is a con & a scam IMO & the IRS most likely sees it that way as well.I do not wish to call to find out exact details nor do I imagine Roger or Milo do.I have said that many many times.
If you wish to disagree then that is fine with me.

Rules laws &/or codes are involved with charities & donations whether they are churches or not.I have known a guy that went to jail for posing as charity & accepting donations.If you wish to disagree than do so.

IMO the head of the IRS could have a book of blank pages & it does not IMO remove the fact that people are in prisons & jails for tax issues.
Read this thread if you wish to or have not seen it.
http://www.thc-ministry.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8479
I do not file ,have not earned a penny for more then 17 years & shall not ever earn a single dime for the rest of my life.If you wish to think if one does not ever file is a some kind of safe guard against prosecutions on tax stuff continue do so ,I simply see that as naive.

I bid(offer)U peace & agree to disagree
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My surname Spinello
means "jOINT of cannabis" in Italian.
JOINT as in anOINT ,appOINT & OINTment.

Check out my Hemperor & Hawaii themes for Firefox.

Pay heed,I plead,Plant the seed ,. 4 we all
need, the reed weed seed
to be freed, from greed and creeds!

I bid(offer)U peace
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prntrkmt
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Grannymouse wrote:
I was under the impression that ALL churches and religions are constitutionally considered FREE of govt, here in the usa, at least. It is only when they sign into 'anything' with the govt, that they come under the govt's 'control'. You are not 'legally required' to do anything with your church! That would be interFEARence by the govt!


Quoting from IRS publication p1828.pdf (available for free from the IRS website), inside front cover:

"Congress has enacted special tax laws applicable to churches, religious organizations, and ministers in recognition of their unique status in American society and of their rights guaranteed by the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States."

From page 2:

"The term church is found, but not specifically defined, in the Internal revenue Code (IRC). The term is not used by all faiths; however, in an attempt to make this publication easy to read, we use it in its generic sense as a place of worship including, for example, mosques and synagogues."

From page 3:

"Automatic Exemption for Churches

Churches that meet the requirements of IRC section 501(c)(3) are automatically considered tax exempt and are not required to apply for and obtain recognition of tax-exempt status from the IRS.

Although there is no requirement to do so, many churches seek recognition of tax-exempt status from the IRS because such recognition assures church leaders, members, and contributors that the church is recognized as exempt and qualifies for related tax benefits. For example, contributors to a church that has been recognized as tax exempt would know that their contributions generally are tax-deductible."

From the same page:

"Religious Organizations

Unlike churches, religious organizations that wish to be tax exempt generally must apply to the IRS for tax-exempt status unless their gross receipts do not normally exceed $5,000 annually."

From page 4:

"Cost for applying for exemption. The IRS is required to collect a non-refundable fee from any organization seeking a determination of tax-exempt status under IRC section 501(c)(3). Although churches are not required by law to file an application for exemption, if they choose to do so voluntarily, they are required to pay the fee for determination."

Also from page 4:

"Note that not every organization that is eligible to receive tax-deductible contributions is listed in Publication 78. For example, churches that have not applied for recognition of tax-exempt status are not included in the publication."

So, the IRS leaves it to the option of each church as to whether they want to fill out a whole bunch of paperwork and pay very expensive fees or not.

The only advantage I can see to filling out the paperwork is having the Determination Letter and being listed in Publication 78, which would be useful only if you are attempting to get multi-million dollar grants.

And despite the claim by the IRS that a church is a "generic" term, I personally think it is illegal for them to use the term church and force non-Christians to use that term.
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