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IntrepidEZJ
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 1:38 am    Post subject: I need facts Reply with quote

I have been debating about using hemp as an alternative to middle east oil.

Yet, a suprisingly simple question has me stuck.

Since there "are" countries around the world where hemp IS LEGAL, why have they not capitalized on the opportunity, and converted to hemp instead of Middle East oil.

Facts appreciated, and not conspiracy theories. Smile
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Rev. Steven Wilson
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 3:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok here is a fact. Henry Ford ran his first automobiles on hemp fuel. He didn't like Gasoline. Said it was to combustive and anybody using it was a fool. Also Hemp fuel is like a diesel so you would have to convert you engine. I don’t know the process to make fuel out of the oil but I imagine you would need a lot of damn seeds as that’s where the oil is. Would it be cheap? No. It would be better for the ecosystem and IS RENEWABLE. Other than suggesting googleing it, that’s about it. Hope this helps.
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Nachtschattenreich
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which country with a capability for technological and agricultural adventures has legally and ideologically left behind prohibition?
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IntrepidEZJ
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, for example:

How is Sweden, Holland, or France doing with the hemp oil industry?

If they are progressive, why has it not replaced Oil from deep in the ground?
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DJ Druid
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

and a moral question...even if hemp was a viable alternative to middle east oil, would it be good to plant the vast amount of crop lands necessary to produce enough oil to power our single occupant cars, or would that land be better used for food production? Perhaps it is not so much an oil source question as a lifestlye question.
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prntrkmt
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:27 am    Post subject: Re: I need facts Reply with quote

IntrepidEZJ wrote:
I have been debating about using hemp as an alternative to middle east oil.

Yet, a suprisingly simple question has me stuck.

Since there "are" countries around the world where hemp IS LEGAL, why have they not capitalized on the opportunity, and converted to hemp instead of Middle East oil.

Facts appreciated, and not conspiracy theories. Smile


Jack Herer's book "The Emperor Wears No Clothes" -- chapter 9 discusses the use of hemp seed oil for fuel ( see http://www.digitalhemp.com/hemp/html/emp/09/ech09_00.htm ) and the appendix (not available on line) has a lengthy article about research at the University of Hawaii that showed ONLY four plants produced more energy than it took to harvest and process. The greatest of these planst was of course hemp. Corn actually takes more total calories of fuel for growing and processing than the number of calories of energy in the resulting fuel!
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David
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DJ,

Man there are more deserts in the world than arable land. we need to convert these deserts, but all the time we pull out the oil the deserts are getting larger. the conversion of this evil oil must be done with great thought if we were just to stop using oil we may cause our own extinction.
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Ferre
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there's a misconception going on about the Hemp and those countries that do not prohibit the cultivation.

The misconception is that the question asked here assumes that the governments of those countries decide what products are made with this hemp. Governments do not do that.

As with any other industry, it's the companies that buy the hemp from the farmers that deside what they make with that Hemp. For example in Poland and other former communist countries there is lots of Hemp growing, the companies that use this Hemp are mostly textile companies. The Polish government as like any other government does not have any jurisdiction to tell hemp industries what to make with their Hemp, that's a desicion made by the industry, not the government.
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DJ Druid
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

David wrote:
if we were just to stop using oil we may cause our own extinction.


its going to happen sooner rather than later...perhaps not our extinction, but certainly the extinction of our Ford Explorer way of life...I would urge everyone interested in oil and alternative energy and our civilization to read a book called "The Long Emergency: Surviving the Converging Catastrophes of the Twenty-First Century" by James Howard Kunstler. It is a bit depressing, but it will start moving one's mind away from magic solutions and wishfull thinking. The amount of hemp oil, or any other type of vegitable oil, will simply not be available to run the world the way we have enjoyed it on fossil fuels. I totally agree, however, that farmers should be allowed to grow hemp.
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David
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Radio,

I mean it when I say "may cause". unfortunatly, we as humans are becoming weak minded and when we talk about big change like the termination of the use of fossil fuels, we can not bring ourselves to lose the weak, and they will die without fossil fuel, especially half the population of Africa. We have developed our world, but the third world rely on us to build it for them. For us now to say, sorry we are not using fossil fuels anymore so we are all third world, just won't wear with a left wing goverment. As you kind of said before this will be a depressing time
for non sacrement users.
I am in favour for Nucler power and fusion power, come on everyone have a moan Very Happy
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DJ Druid
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 5:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

David wrote:
I am in favour for Nucler power and fusion power, come on everyone have a moan Very Happy


I think this goes beyond left wing/right wing, us/them, etc. The fact is (as far as I have read) that we have passed peak oil extraction and are on the downward slope. Demand is rising quickly from China and India, especially. We have maybe 50 years left, max, in our current fossel fuel civilzation, and every day from today until they pump the last drop will be a change. Nuclear, wind, solar, tidal, bio-fuels, etc, will all be employed to keep the lights on (in some places), but the real problem will be with our trasnsportation and economic grid. Collectively, we have decided that we want to eat food grown 2,000 miles away and trucked up from Chile and buy junk from giant stores like Walmart instead of producing things locally, etc. And electric cars and trucks will not be able to move product around like we have grown to expect, even if we cut down every last forest to grow the biofuel, which we would have to do to keep things at the current level of usage.. And we all know the turds we elect to office will do nothing. We have to start looking after ourselves locally. And indeed, herb will make everything better. Very Happy
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Brother Adam
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm afraid peak oil and global warming are looking more and more like scams to control the masses every day. Neither can be fully scientifically substantiated, especially global warming. I actually started to believe both for a short time. Thank god for an open mind.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't be looking for alternative fuel sources. We can't breath the fumes we put off forever, so a more environmentally friendly approach is necessary. We need clean water and clean air to survive, so these topics are valid, but I would not be so quick to fall prey to the global warming/peak oil scares. However, we should also be looking at the motives behind these two topics very closely.
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Brother Adam
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The great global warming swindle: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4499562022478442170&q=great+global+warming+swindle&hl=en
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-Brother Adam (we are all one family)

“Knowledge will forever govern ignorance; and a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives.”

-James Madison

Police officers acquitted for beating a 64 yr old man recently in New Orleans. In the words of their defense attorney "all he had to do was comply"....and they wouldn't have fractured his face.
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DJ Druid
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where is the "sponsored by Exxon Mobile" logo on that video?? Wink

Hey, I am no scientist...I don't understand most of the stuff I read on this topic. I have been reading books and articles about Hubbard's Peak for awhile...it isn't a new theory, but one that was developed in the 1950's. It makes sense to me that oil is not renuable and will run out one day...soon, according to some.....it was made under specific conditions at a specific time in the planets history, that cannot be repeated (at least not in under a few hundred million years) I tend to believe the Hubbard's Peak theory (although I won't even try to explain it...a quick google will turn up loads of info) http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/feature/story/0,13026,1464050,00.html

I agree with you that it is important to keep an open mind, and I'm sure everyone from the politicians to the environmental scientists to the oil companies to the solar panel manufactureres will try to spin the facts and stats to their own benefit, so it is good to have broad input of data and opinion.

I do feel, instinctively, that it would be healthy for ourselves and the planet to consume local food and products, drive less (or not at all), not jet around on vacations, and not live in the artificial Walmart bubble we currently reside in. I also believe the only changes we can make are in our own lives. "Society" isn't going to change....someone with a vested interest will always be ready in the wings with a youtube video or "news" report that will counter any half-truth with another half-truth. We have become so lazy and stupid and apathetic as a society that we can't tell lies from truth...don't even care when we are being lied to, as long as we are entertained.

I think the best thing ever invented for/by government was the "Conspiracy Theory". "9/11 was an inside job? Wacky internet people!" "The election was rigged?? Where is your tinfoil hat!" Everything is suddenly a conspiracy theory, and thus automatically discredited.

Sigh..I wish I wasn't dry right now....I'm depressing myself! Gonna go walk my dog.
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David
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Radio, as you may well know, there are lots of food sorces on this planet that we turn our noses up at, because we are ignorant and wasteful, and they are on our door step, we will have to eat them again one day.
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