THC Ministry :: Community Forum Index
AustraliaBasqueBulgariaCanadaChinaEgyptFranceGreeceIcelandIndiaIndonesiaIrelandJamaicaJapanJordanLatviaMexicoNetherlandsNew Zealand
NorwaySpainPakistanLebanonPeruPolandPeurto RicoRomaniaRussiaSingaporeSouth AfricaSudanSwedenThailandTurkeyUnited KingdomUSAUzbekistan
Does pot really need to be legal?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    THC Ministry :: Community Forum Index -> Discussions
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Romadon
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 20 Jun 2004
Posts: 674
Location: Indiana - USA

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Echo wrote:
DEA is not legitimate and their actions controversial. And yes, cannabis should stay legal as it has been for thousand of years.

I totally agree with you echo, any person or organization that attempts to replace God's law with their own so-called law/laws most certainly is lacking legitimacy, and in reality their so called laws only exist in their own minds and the minds of those foolish enough to swallow their propaganda, put their trust in them, or believe in the wicked lies they have the audacity to call laws.


Last edited by Romadon on Fri Aug 20, 2004 11:35 pm; edited 3 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Pateticus
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Cleveland

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 3:57 pm    Post subject: Thing is... Reply with quote

By forcing everyone that doesn't believe in the legitimacy of cannibis use to accept it and teach their children about it...aren't we being just as bad as they are?


Pateticus
_________________
Here's to burning one down with god.
Don't forget to look behind you every once in awhile
and always exhale with a grin.

Wink
http://members.cox.net/pateticus/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Echo
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 14 Apr 2003
Posts: 956
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't believe so Pateticus. Prohibition of cannabis is hystorically a relative new concept and I don't believe it to be a good choice either. With 40% of people from 16 years of age to 25 admitting to having smoked cannabis in the UK I am prone to believe that this experiment started in the USA last century and spreaded to our countries, is not bringing the desired results. Telling children that prohibition doesn't work is not lieing to them. Teaching children to take full responsibility for their actions works a lot better, and it works all round their personality. They become better people whether they decide to use cannabis or not.
_________________
'You, your joys and your sorrows, your memories and your ambitions, your sense of personal identity and free will, are in fact no more than the behaviour of a vast assembly of nerve cells and their associated molecules,' Francis Crick (1916~2004)

Kent THC Ministry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Pateticus
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Cleveland

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:01 pm    Post subject: But that's not the way the public sees it... Reply with quote

Because we're still hiding in our basements getting stoned and planning marches against political regimes to force our way towards legalization.

The conservative families that have been teaching their kids that all drugs are bad are going to see that as a hostile move and as forcing their hand about what they need to teach their kids. Whether you say it's a positive message or not--they don't feel their children should be taught that particular responsibility--as strange as that may seem to us.

It is unethical to tell a parent how and what to teach their own child.

Pateticus
_________________
Here's to burning one down with god.
Don't forget to look behind you every once in awhile
and always exhale with a grin.

Wink
http://members.cox.net/pateticus/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lilli
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 3371

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
By forcing everyone that doesn't believe in the legitimacy of cannibis use to accept it and teach their children about it...aren't we being just as bad as they are?



No way is that as bad as they are. We are teaching and highlighting constituional and biblical rights and facts. What they on the other hand are teaching is wrong and lies. Teaching children in DARE programs that sick people are criminals and terrorists is socialy & moraly wrong. "We the People" is made up of a sick and ailing nation. We're not asking them to smoke. We're asking for the freedom to heal OUR sick bodies biblicaly.
These same people that teach all drugs are bad are the ones that are voting for a satanist for president. Skull and Bones proves that. If they choose to stay in the dark let them. We choose to live in the LIGHT.
_________________
"Today I choose to be happy. Today nothing will bother me. Today I'll have a great day!"
Lord Help me to remember that nothing is going to happen to me today that YOU and I together cannot handle.
http://www.missouri-thc-ministries.tk
" I pass to you the torch that Christ once passed to me,others are still in the dark an need the light to see"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Pateticus
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Cleveland

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:20 pm    Post subject: Everybody makes their own way... Reply with quote

They have every right to teach and believe however and whatever they want to teach and believe. It is their god-given, human right.

By taking a spiritual side to this and by taking our spirituality into politics, any way you look at it, we are forcing our beliefs onto other people and that's wrong.

We should know better because we've felt the brunt of it all this time.

Embracing your community and bringing joy to your community is a kinder, gentler way to reach legalization. It worked for the gay people.

They went out there, they made friends, they got to know people...and eventually, nobody cared.

It can work the same way with cannibis.

Pateticus
_________________
Here's to burning one down with god.
Don't forget to look behind you every once in awhile
and always exhale with a grin.

Wink
http://members.cox.net/pateticus/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Rev. Chazman
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 15 Nov 2003
Posts: 1037
Location: Illinois - USA

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Be careful what you ask for Reply with quote

RogerChristie wrote:
Aloha from here to there,

'Be careful what you ask for' is still a fine, smart saying. 'Illegal' cannabis makes most of us think that we want it 'legal'. Right? I say, 'no thank you'. This discussion makes us think about it more thoroughly. Thanks to Pateticus for starting it and to all who comment on it.

I no longer work for 'legalizing' herb. It's a losing game, in my opinion. All that work and all that money spent for all that time and it's still not 'legal' in the USA. Tens of millions of dollars spent and tens of thousands of people who have tried to do it with almost zero success, except for some 'medical marijuana' laws which have passed.
.......

Roger... I totally agree with you.. And I totally disagree with you.

Let me explain. In so far as the work we are doing with and for the THC-Ministry is concerned, yes I agree that working to get religious use recognized is important and well worth doing.

But as I mentioned before in my other post... This goal, and the goal of freeing ALL Cannabis users from injustice are two separate issues.

In my opinion you are dead wrong about the legalization issue. That you have given up on it and focus on religious use is fine and fitting given our organizations focus.... BUT.. I believe I (we?) have to continue to work for the freedoms of ALL cannabis users whether they are a part of our organization or not. Should it be the focus of the THC-Ministry? Perhaps not.. that’s why I said they are two separate issues.

I do understand your reply though and the reasons you give for giving up on legalization.. Frustrating isn’t it? Yes. It is a hard struggle. But I don’t believe its wasted effort or beyond reach. The only way it wont work eventually is if everyone gives up. There are a lot of people just as passionate about, and fully committed to the legalization issue, as you (we) are to the Religious Use issues. And I believe their efforts are just as valid a fight.

Anyway, I will at least continue to believe in and fight for both fronts. They are both valid and achievable goals in my opinion. Is it going to be easy? No, we already know that.. But I wont give up. And there are 1000's of otherwise law abiding, decent individuals arrested every year that need people in there fighting for them. Not all of them are THC-Ministry inclined.... Legalization is the answer for them.

Legalization also doesn’t negate the need or usefulness of the THC-Ministry either. Or it doesn’t if we are building the organization right. If our only goal is to protect Sacrament users then we need to establish our foundation as a religious and spiritual organization more firmly. For when Cannabis is legal (I believe it will be) we will still need our religious and spiritual organizations to provide for our religious needs.

Anyway that’s what I think anyway... I never did admit to being very bright though... Smile

Peace
_________________
***********************
Dont blame me... I voted for Kerry!! And so did my home state.
***********************
THC-Ministry "we use Cannabis religiously and you can to" http://www.thc-ministry.org/
***********************
Take nothing but memories, Leave nothing but footprints.
CDXX Peace Time IV:XX ** Rev.Chazman-Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
RogerChristie
Cannabis Sacrament Minister.
Cannabis Sacrament Minister.


Joined: 16 Feb 2004
Posts: 284
Location: Hilo, Kingdom of Hawai'i

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:54 pm    Post subject: I like our 'method' the best! Reply with quote

Dear Friends,

Aloha. The more I think about who I am, who we are and what we're up against, the better I like the THC Ministry method. We're 'LEGAL' now. And I'm open to new ideas and strategy and to be more enlightened all the time.

In God's eyes cannabis is - obviously - free and 'legal'. That's mostly what we need to know and feel and communicate when necessary. Mankind's laws are often strange things that are hard to figure and harder to obey, especially the ones against nature and our sacrament.

Please remember that to qualify for a religious 'defense to prosecution' or an exemption to the prohibition, we must be:

1. sincere religious user
2. be legitimate (ordained, licensed practitioner, etc.)
3. cannabis must be MANDATORY for our spiritual well being
4. we can only grow and use it in PRIVATE at home or church
5. there can be zero commerce, or sales of the holy herb

I can live with these rules for now. I AM living with these rules and enjoying my life pretty well...AND I want to make much more progress, too. Our injunction is part of the progress forward I desire. My candidacy for Mayor of this island is another part of the progress I want to see happen. Can you imagine if I would win? The reborn 'cannabis kingdom' here on Earth. Oh my god...

I'm a cannabis minister AND I'm political, too. That fits my personality now and it works for me to be an 'activist minister'. You will likely have a different direction and lifestyle. Who knows?

In my opinion, the most important thing for each of us is to build (y)our own defense to prosecution NOW. Then if it still makes sense for you to do so, take all the time and the money and the effort you want to invest and try and make cannabis legal for others. The THC Ministry is THE best method or formula I know of on Earth, and it's the most successful, too. Amazing. Hallelujah!

In my opinion, working for NORML or MPP or the ACLU is a waste of time and effort if you want cannabis legal. It's already legal for sincere and legitimate religious users! Be one and have fun.

love, Roger
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Echo
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 14 Apr 2003
Posts: 956
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Third try

lol I get logged off often, I hope this gets through.

What do you mean when you say I am teaching other people's children Pateticus? I don't think I am doing it here. Yes, we are all somebody's children, still I am not teaching, I am expressing my opinion. Same as you.
_________________
'You, your joys and your sorrows, your memories and your ambitions, your sense of personal identity and free will, are in fact no more than the behaviour of a vast assembly of nerve cells and their associated molecules,' Francis Crick (1916~2004)

Kent THC Ministry
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Lilli
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 3371

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I'm a cannabis minister AND I'm political, too. That fits my personality now and it works for me to be an 'activist minister'.


Thats working for me. Ill keep up my fight.
_________________
"Today I choose to be happy. Today nothing will bother me. Today I'll have a great day!"
Lord Help me to remember that nothing is going to happen to me today that YOU and I together cannot handle.
http://www.missouri-thc-ministries.tk
" I pass to you the torch that Christ once passed to me,others are still in the dark an need the light to see"


Last edited by Lilli on Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:28 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Pateticus
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Cleveland

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:21 pm    Post subject: Regarding what/how we're teaching our kids... Reply with quote

Like it or not, this is the information generation. The media, for too many kids, is another parent and/or teacher. If not a substitute teacher/parent.

Anything we accomplish, politically, is going to be big enough to reach the news and their ears. It's going to have them coming home to their parents with questions about drugs, and cause issues in the family with regards to spiritual belief, lifestyle and responsibility.

Again, I mention the gay lifestyle as an example. When we started seeing shows like Ellen and Will & Grace on the air, the conservative argument was that having these shows on television was now resulting in familial conflicts as these children now had to be taught in their schools how to deal with people and values they were taught were wrong.

All of a sudden, their whole life and value system had to change because one person decided to push their issues onto the rest of the world.

I found it a very valid argument. When you mess with and question established traditions, you mess with family. With the proverbial 'glue' that holds families together.

Whether we agree with some families' traditions or not, it's still their every right to have them. You wouldn't want someone telling you what traditions you have to follow or accept.

Pateticus
_________________
Here's to burning one down with god.
Don't forget to look behind you every once in awhile
and always exhale with a grin.

Wink
http://members.cox.net/pateticus/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Lilli
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 3371

PostPosted: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
established traditions, you mess with family. With the proverbial 'glue' that holds families together.

Whether we agree with some families' traditions or not, it's still their every right to have them. You wouldn't want someone telling you what traditions you have to follow or accept.


Here is the traditions we hold true. Our forfathers smoked cannabis and it was raised freely and without fear,

an excerpt from:
The Politics Of Consciousness
by Steve Kubby Loompanics Press

lf ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude
better than the animated contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We
ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed
you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that
ye were our countrymen. --Samuel Adams

If the Founding Fathers were alive today, they would never stand for
the War on Drugs. Thomas Jefferson would immediately convene a war crimes
commission to investigate and punish those responsible for the jailing of more
than 600,000 Americans. Ben Franklin would be building homemade Patriot
missiles. George Washington and his men would be using those Patriot missiles
to blow DEA choppers out of the sky. Sam Adams would be preaching revolution
on college campuses. Ethan Allen would be burning U.S. Customs boats.
Thomas Paine would be writing books like this, and Paul Revere would ride up
and down the Northern California coast, warning marijuana growers that,
'The Feds are coming, the Feds are coming!"

An exaggeration? Not at all; the men who founded this country
believed that marijuana, which they called hemp, was critical to America. In
Colonial America it was a crime NOT to grow hemp. Jamestown Colony, Virginia,
ordered all farmers to grow hemp and later jailed those who didn't
comply.(34) Hemp was valued for its fiber, and its medicinal properties. Hemp allowed
America to have its own colonial press, without having to beg for paper from
England. Our great revolutionary documents such as Common Sense, The
Federalist Papers, The Declaration of Independence, and The Constitution were
all printed on paper made from hemp. Science fiction writer and Ph.D.
Robert Anton Wilson has suggested that because George Washington smoked pot,
he was able to formulate non-linear military strategies that often surprised
and bewildered the British Redcoats.(35) Our American flag and even blue
jeans were originally made from hemp. Marijuana, it turns out, is as
American as apple pie. Nobody in your government-run school ever taught you these
historical facts, did they?

The men and women who founded this great country fought many a brave
battle to secure our liberties. Once the war was won, these patriots
resolved to create a government that would be "of the people and by the
people." Our government was established to be a servant of the people, not the
other way around. The signers of the Constitution were deeply concerned about
government getting out of control and added ten amendments to the
Constitution for the express purpose of limiting the powers of the
federal government. Let's take a closer look at the incredible document these
men created to protect our rights from the abuses of government.


American history, as it was taught to us, is a watered down, sanitized,
fictional account, created by government-run schools. American
history is not a bunch of old men, sitting around and having intellectual
discussions. It's about young, long haired, radical patriots smuggling contraband,
staging raids against their oppressors, bravely fighting for their
liberty, and proclaiming across the land, "Don't Tread on Me." The
founders of this country were not the sort of nerds and geeks you find today in the
Republican and Democratic parties. They were more like the courageous
heroes you'll find in Greenpeace. Our Founding Fathers were men of ideals,
who were not afraid to fight to win their freedom. Like the brave Rainbow
Warriors of Greenpeace, they did not hesitate to risk their necks to dramatize an
important issue. The Boston Tea Party is a great example of how our forefathers stood up to tyranny with tactics like those of Greenpeace.
_________________
"Today I choose to be happy. Today nothing will bother me. Today I'll have a great day!"
Lord Help me to remember that nothing is going to happen to me today that YOU and I together cannot handle.
http://www.missouri-thc-ministries.tk
" I pass to you the torch that Christ once passed to me,others are still in the dark an need the light to see"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Pateticus
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 102
Location: Cleveland

PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 12:33 am    Post subject: Regardless... Reply with quote

It's been a long, long time since those souls have walked the earth.

The children of today haven't been taught those values, they were taught different values. And the changes that we're thinking of making are going to effect today's children, not the children that were alive when the country was first founded.

To keep bringing up history and mythology only makes the argument redundant. If we keep doing that we never make it out of the past. Our forefathers never saw the internet coming, nor did they see criminalization on the horizon. Nor did they see bioterrorism or nuclear weapons or government espionage...

We need to think about the future and what effect our actions are going to have on tomorrow's leaders...not on what yesterday's leaders have left behind.

We know that today's politicians and too many parents aren't thinking about the future generations--it's evident in the fact that we do have to be concerned about the media's effect on our children.

That's how we prove that we're better than they are. To show patience, kindness and faith at a time when everyone around us believes in sudden change and aggression.

Isn't that the point of relying on ministry rather than politics? Or is it true what the Supreme Court says and the only reason we're all THC-Ministers is so we can hide in our homes and get stoned?

Pateticus
_________________
Here's to burning one down with god.
Don't forget to look behind you every once in awhile
and always exhale with a grin.

Wink
http://members.cox.net/pateticus/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
machete
Honourable member
Honourable member


Joined: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 233
Location: Ecuador

PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I totally agree with you Pateticus. The moment cannabis becomes legal, it will not take much time until it is taken its real holy value and put in people´s minds a commercial value instead. marlboro will be selling it, and it will become exactly like alcohol and tobacco, even like coca cola.
I agree with Roger also, it is kind of a waste of time and effort trying to legalize cannabis, it is something that only a few have some kind of culture about it; what I mean is that there are millions of people who use cannabis, but not all of them use it as a sacrament but just like drug, so with legalization comes a great deal, that is educating people about it, and educating people is so hard to do, I would say almost impossible when you have tv that tells people only what to buy. I think that instead of trying to legalize it, we should keep showing people what the real benefits of cannabis are.
I think we should just wait until the laws become a joke. there would be a moment when you will smoke your herb in the streets freely without taking care of the law. In Ecuador it happens like that with many laws like they didn´t even exist, its just that it is almost everyone that goes against the law that it is like a common knowledge that you can break a lot of laws. It will take a lot of time, so just take a smoke and enjoy while you wait that to happen. lol. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Lilli
Cannabis Sacrament Minister
Cannabis Sacrament Minister


Joined: 12 Dec 2003
Posts: 3371

PostPosted: Fri Aug 06, 2004 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Isn't that the point of relying on ministry rather than politics? Or is it true what the Supreme Court says and the only reason we're all THC-Ministers is so we can hide in our homes and get stoned?

Where and when did the "SUPREME COURT" Say that????? My ministry is alot more then hiding in my home smoking pot. I know Rogers and Ferres is much more then that as well.

http://www.thc-ministry.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1832&start=0
_________________
"Today I choose to be happy. Today nothing will bother me. Today I'll have a great day!"
Lord Help me to remember that nothing is going to happen to me today that YOU and I together cannot handle.
http://www.missouri-thc-ministries.tk
" I pass to you the torch that Christ once passed to me,others are still in the dark an need the light to see"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    THC Ministry :: Community Forum Index -> Discussions All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 2 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
Public forum Public Forum Members only Members only forum Members Group Members Group

THC-Light skin designed for Amsterdam Cannabis Ministry by JuggoPop of Touchstonestudio.com
Powered by phpBB | THC Ministry Members | Cannabis Religion | Sacrament | Forum html archives | Site Map |
ScriptWiz.com phpbb HTML Archiver - Created by ScriptWiz.com and released by Skinz.org