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Calamus is psychoactive too!

 
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ministrynewbie
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:50 pm    Post subject: Calamus is psychoactive too! Reply with quote

I don't get this...

I've been researching all this stuff recently, and here is my thing.

It does seem possible calamus is actually what was used in the annointing oil. First off, the ayurvedic tradition uses it for seizures...which would explain how jesus used it for epilepsy. I know cannabis does this too.

Also, according to some articles on erowid.org (look it up), calamus was even used to induce religious experiences.

Kanabus, or whatever the greek word...means aromatic reed. Calamus is a reed, and its aromatic.

It calls for 9 pounds of the stuff. 9 pounds might be the right amount. Why would someone use 9 pounds of cannabis? Doesn't that seem like too much?

I mean, I kinda want to believe that cannabis was in the holy annointing oil.... but it just seems very possible it truly WAS calamus.

I would like to discuss this matter further. I mean, in a way it doesn't even matter, but in a way it kinda does. You can either look at it that God gave us all plants for our use... and that it was also in the oil. But if it truly was in the OIL, then you could kinda counter any of that "the bible says don't use drugs" talk. u know?

okay i'm done
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are strains of Calamus that contain enough toxins to make you sick as well. Can't say the same about Kaneh-Bosem.

To be fair, I have a few ounces of dried Calamus root in my cupboard but it doesn't have the same sacramental quality that Cannabis does.
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ministrynewbie
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:23 am    Post subject: okay, but Reply with quote

I understand this, but lets just make things clear.

Before we make a claim, and make a whole website and movement out of it, don't you think we should be really CLEAR exactly what that verse was referring to?

Its one thing if calamus was just a boring old plant with no medicinal/spiritual qualities whatsoever.

Its a whole nother thing when calamus actually has those qualities, AND is an aromatic reed...which is the translation. Also its similar to the word cannabis.

So, is there anyway to really be sure????

I would like to see more evidence.

Officer - what types of sacramental qualties does calamus have?

Okay, upon further research on calamus:

From http://www.erowid.org/herbs/calamus/calamus_info1.shtml
Quote:
First off there are two strains, with greatly different effects.
One of these strains has been determined to be carcinogenic and
the other has not been assayed. Most of the literature refers
to the carcinogenic strain which originally comes from Asia.
There is also a strain which is indigenous to America which was
held to be sacred by the Native Americans. It was used in
religous rituals, rumor has it, that it helps see into the spirit
world. It was also taboo to sell the root, it could only be
freely given as a gift or the root wouldn't bestow it's properties.


And some more info on calamus from
http://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/golden_guide/g71-80.shtml#SWEETFLAG
Quote:
SWEET FLAG (Acorus calamus), also called sweet calomel, grows in damp places in the north and south temperate regions. A member of the arum family, Araceae, it is one of two species of Acorus. There is some indirect evidence that Indians of northern Canada, who employ the plant as a medicine and a stimulant, may chew the rootstock as an hallucinogen. In excessive doses, it is known to induce strong visual hallucinations. The intoxicating properties may be due to a-asorone and ß-asarone, but the chemistry and pharmacology of the plant are still poorly understood.


Here is what I'm thinking. Its interesting that calamus could "see into the spirit world". Also, its known to cause strong hallucinations... would these be the kind of hallucinations that would make a person see god, or anything like that? I'm not familair, but in the bible when someone was giving holy annointing oil, would they have very strong hallucinogenic experiences?? What type of experiences would they have? Aside from the holy spirit intervening, maybe we could determine if its cannabis or calamus by the types of experiences people had with the oil.

I know that when people in South America take peyote and stuff, its such a strong experience that the experience lasts with them for a LONG time. Does cannabis have this kind of power? I would think its possible, that by using a lot of it, and having it absorbed through the skin and let sit there before being washed off, thats its possible an experience so strong could be made, that people would see things. But in my experience, I've never had a hallucinogenic experience from weed, more of a feeling of connecting with something spiritual.

Again, I'm not familiar with the specific parts of the bible... but did Jesus go on that 40 day 40 night thing after being annointed? That sounds like one of those vision quests...or maybe he had such a strong hallucinogenic experience from the oil that he had to sort things out in his head.

Another thing to consider, was if calamus (the psychoactive root), could actually be grown in the area where the bible was.

But I think what could really answer this question, is if its even possible to combine calamus root into an oil... because, it seems that all of the herbs used in the mix were stewed in the olive oil before being strained...is this right? Well, would anyone know if calamus root was even fat-soluble? Would the hallucinogenic chemicals even get into the oil if stewed in it? If not, then it seems cannabis has an even truer shot of being the real deal used.

I'm not against cannabis being used in the oil, but I just think we should make things clear.

Thanks
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Ferre
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Before we make a claim, and make a whole website and movement out of it, don't you think we should be really CLEAR exactly what that verse was referring to?


Dude, we did NOT make a "movement" out of the issue of caneth bosm, this religion is NOT based on that.

These are our tenets:


The THC Ministry is based on ancient wisdom, modern science & the enlightening & healing properties of cannabis sacrament.

And these are our mandates:

http://www.thc-ministry.net/cannabis-sacrament.htm

As for the so called "holy annointing oil"

Some of us, including me, do not believe anything written in the bible, for all I know it's a fairy tale.

I DO KNOW, HOWEVER, THAT:

The recepy for "healing oil" containing CANNABIS (NOT calamus) and the other ingredients as discribed have been known in CHINESE MEDICINE for centuries BEFORE the bible was written, this is a historical fact.

For all I know those dudes who wrote the bible borrowed that recipy and changed Cannabis into calamus. But that's not possible to prove in any way, all I know is that this recipy existed long before the bible was written.

Have a happy day.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:23 am    Post subject: You make some good points, and ... Reply with quote

Hello ministrynewbie,

Aloha and welcome to the THC Ministry. Thanks for participating and for rocking our boat a little with your good questions and comments.

It's a very worthwhile debate about calamus vs. Cannabis, and the implications of Cannabis in the holy oil are HUGE.

So, is there anyway to really be sure????

I would like to see more evidence.

Here's some evidence for you: http://thc-ministry.org/thelivingtorah.jpg

Here's more: http://thc-ministry.org/jesus.htm

maybe we could determine if its cannabis or calamus by the types of experiences people had with the oil?

Yes. We've had one person say that he took a full hornfull of the Cannabis HAO. After two hours of entertaining thoughts and healing energy he said he couldn't stand the thoughts in his head any longer so he dove into the ocean for a washoff.

Again, I'm not familiar with the specific parts of the bible... but did Jesus go on that 40 day 40 night thing after being annointed? That sounds like one of those vision quests...or maybe he had such a strong hallucinogenic experience from the oil that he had to sort things out in his head.

Good point! A 'hornfull' is a lot of HAO taken at one time. It might take days to come down.

But I think what could really answer this question, is if its even possible to combine calamus root into an oil... because, it seems that all of the herbs used in the mix were stewed in the olive oil before being strained...is this right? Well, would anyone know if calamus root was even fat-soluble? Would the hallucinogenic chemicals even get into the oil if stewed in it? If not, then it seems cannabis has an even truer shot of being the real deal used.

Cannabis resin melts into the hot olive oil and infuses into it. Good point.

I'm not against cannabis being used in the oil, but I just think we should make things clear.

You are intellectually honest to question this. I appreciate your curiosity and desire for CERTAINTY on this crucial matter.

I'm CERTAIN that kaneh bosm = Cannabis. How? Two important Hebrew-English dictionaries confirm the word is marijuana or hemp, and the Living Torah says that some people identify kaneh bos with Cannabis, the hemp plant. And it heals gangrene - known by modern medicine as incurable.

HAO made with Cannabis is a big blessing in my personal and professional life - and in the life of our Ministry. Please try some for yourself and see.

By the way, I LOVE calamus root powder, too! I smoke a pinch of it with my Cannabis almost every time since 1992. It's a mental and physical 'awakener'.

I wasn't there to meet Moses and see what he used, Cannabis or calamus, but I know what I see and experience with Cannabis HAO. It's so miraculous and healing that I'm CERTAIN it contains Cannabis.

All the very best to you,

Roger


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oldmanmozz
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ferre wrote:
Quote:
Before we make a claim, and make a whole website and movement out of it, don't you think we should be really CLEAR exactly what that verse was referring to?


Dude, we did NOT make a "movement" out of the issue of caneth bosm, this religion is NOT based on that.

These are our tenets:


The THC Ministry is based on ancient wisdom, modern science & the enlightening & healing properties of cannabis sacrament.

And these are our mandates:

http://www.thc-ministry.net/cannabis-sacrament.htm

As for the so called "holy annointing oil"

Some of us, including me, do not believe anything written in the bible, for all I know it's a fairy tale.

I DO KNOW, HOWEVER, THAT:

The recepy for "healing oil" containing CANNABIS (NOT calamus) and the other ingredients as discribed have been known in CHINESE MEDICINE for centuries BEFORE the bible was written, this is a historical fact.

For all I know those dudes who wrote the bible borrowed that recipy and changed Cannabis into calamus. But that's not possible to prove in any way, all I know is that this recipy existed long before the bible was written.

Have a happy day.



good stuff Ferre, been here awhile and havnt committed to the ministry as yet, but for sure bro i agree 100% with what you just said, my beliefs in a nutshell reckon Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Calamus is psychoactive too! Reply with quote

ministrynewbie wrote:
I don't get this...

I've been researching all this stuff recently, and here is my thing.

It does seem possible calamus is actually what was used in the annointing oil. First off, the ayurvedic tradition uses it for seizures...which would explain how jesus used it for epilepsy. I know cannabis does this too.

Also, according to some articles on erowid.org (look it up), calamus was even used to induce religious experiences.

Kanabus, or whatever the greek word...means aromatic reed. Calamus is a reed, and its aromatic.

It calls for 9 pounds of the stuff. 9 pounds might be the right amount. Why would someone use 9 pounds of cannabis? Doesn't that seem like too much?

I mean, I kinda want to believe that cannabis was in the holy annointing oil.... but it just seems very possible it truly WAS calamus.

I would like to discuss this matter further. I mean, in a way it doesn't even matter, but in a way it kinda does. You can either look at it that God gave us all plants for our use... and that it was also in the oil. But if it truly was in the OIL, then you could kinda counter any of that "the bible says don't use drugs" talk. u know?

okay i'm done


http://www.thc-ministry.org/thelivingtorah.jpg
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IntrepidEZJ
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think it should certainly be looked into more and I hope to see more comments on this thread regarding it.
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jwag
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting. But for myself, I do not need any historical document to tell me whether or not Cannabis is a spirtual tool, or if it was used in the HAO. My Truth and conviction comes from my trials. I have first hand knowledge of the spirtual use of cannabis and I will give most, if not all, weight into my own personal experiences in life. I know that I have been enlightened through the use of cannabis and that it was definately a tool for many in the past.

This is Truth I know and have in common with many others. Documents have been manipulated through the years. I choose to take everything by the grain of salt until I have meditated upon it and have been enlightened to my satisfaction. If you look within, to your True nature, all answers are waiting to be discovered.

Has anybody ever tried to infuse calamus into oil? If not, somebody ought to try it and let us know. I know that I have vaperized it before and it tasted terrible.lol

Nice discussion here. I'll enjoy learning more. Thanks and Light and love to all!
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Ferre
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem, as I see it, with using that biblical explanation instead of just using ancient Chinese references for the healing oil, is that it asks for comments like that, nothing from the bible can be proven, while the fact that the Chinese used Cannabis in various medicinal oils and other medicines is common knowledge.

I personally would have refreined from those biblical fairy tales to be honest, it discredits our religion which is based on ancient shamanic practises and using those bible references only makes us look like another judeo-christian clone, which I repeat, we are not.
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Last edited by Ferre on Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:22 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 2:18 am    Post subject: Education Reply with quote

Follow www.cannabisculture.com unto pot-t.v.,ethogene 101-bowl up, relax learn. Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 8:33 am    Post subject: Heres my thing Reply with quote

Now first thing to remember with the bible is that we only have copys of copys of copys. Parts left out and put it and all that good stuff. Big stink about it in the news because of that movie with Tom Hanks. With that being said its hard to put that much thought into any word or words in the Bible and to instead look at the message or big picture if you will. As far as cannabis use goes you can't just take the one part, read all the passages Roger has quoted for us. Then go to Jack Herer.com and read everything he has to say then you will see it has to be God's gift to us, just look at how people are when they are high, nice and laid back, we share our smoke with anyone, what else does anyone do that with? Plus it has over 25,000 uses from drywall to rope to gas to shirts to belts to 2x4s and so on (JackHerer.com again) and in almost everyone if not all of its uses it is better than any other thing we use for it (stronger rope, drywall holds nails better, that sort of thing)

Ok for non Bible fans.
again 25,000 uses far more than anything else I can think of. Plus if you read the cannabis info tab on this web site and well turns out we are made of pot! or at least share many of the same cell types. Also our brains are made to take THC we have receptors that only THC can hook on too! Crazy huh? If there is any kinda God or spirit or what ever running the show that is life Cannabis is a huge part of it. Don't know much about the other plant but I don't think it comes close
Quote:
The Cannabinoid System has been around for over 600 million years. Before the Dinosaurs. The Cannabinoid System is continuously evolutioning and has been retained by all new species. Food and feeding is at the heart of the Cannabinoid System.

1. Cannabinoids are in every living animal on the planet above Hydra and Mollusks, with the exception of insects. Bodies are homeostatically maintained by the Cannabinoid System.

2. Mothers give their babies a booster shot of cannabinoids in mothers milk to give them the munchies because they have to learn to eat. (they've been fed thru the umbilical cord and did not have to know how to eat.)

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So?!
where is the Point?!
we´ve got the nature tu use!
what are human beings doin?
Playin God & brew some Beer!
But we can´t say, all from the Nature is good,
mostly Deadly!!!
But not Cannabis!
It´s one of the oldest Medicines on Earth!
It grows everywhere and Human bein tried everything!
I believe,they liked that Stuff!
I believe, the Knowlegde came from China to Jesus!
And then they built the Seidenstraße!Laughing (don´t know the English word for it!Laughing

God bless you all,
Angelo
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